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DNP3 Binary Output Command Trip/Close Block not working as per manual

I have programmed DNP Binary Output controls on my pages and the manual states that if you send an analog value to the tag of "-5000" it should sent a 5 second "Trip" pulse and if you send a value of "5000" it should send a 5 second "Close" pulse.

When i look at my wireshark logs and in my SEL RTAC i just keep getting 1ms Close pulses no matter what i configure.

My points are configured as Trip/Close pairs in the tag.

I will say that i am using "Analog Value" controls as i assume thats the only way to send a non 1/0 value to these DNP controls.
Though this doesnt make sense to use an analog control to operate a binary control in my mind.

I have programmed DNP Binary Output controls on my pages and the manual states that if you send an analog value to the tag of "-5000" it should sent a 5 second "Trip" pulse and if you send a value of "5000" it should send a 5 second "Close" pulse. When i look at my wireshark logs and in my SEL RTAC i just keep getting 1ms Close pulses no matter what i configure. My points are configured as Trip/Close pairs in the tag. I will say that i am using "Analog Value" controls as i assume thats the only way to send a non 1/0 value to these DNP controls. Though this doesnt make sense to use an analog control to operate a binary control in my mind.
edited Oct 21 '22 at 6:51 pm

BDAVIS, what is the device that you are sending to (connected to the RTAC)? Is it another SEL device?

BDAVIS, what is the device that you are sending to (connected to the RTAC)? Is it another SEL device?

Yes it is an SEL RTAC AXION.
I did end of solving this through a support contract contact.

I was unaware that to send a DNP Binary Output you need to set the tag type to "ANALOG" not to "DIGITAL", I guess in hindsight this matches the odd configuration requirements of the button but still.

It would be nice if the manual would be more clear about these requirements as it is very strange to require analog controls mapped to analog tags with binary output DNP address'.

Yes it is an SEL RTAC AXION. I did end of solving this through a support contract contact. I was unaware that to send a DNP Binary Output you need to set the tag type to "ANALOG" not to "DIGITAL", I guess in hindsight this matches the odd configuration requirements of the button but still. It would be nice if the manual would be more clear about these requirements as it is very strange to require analog controls mapped to analog tags with binary output DNP address'.

That is rather odd...
Here is an example of a DNP Binary Out from a live system.

BO Tag using DNP3

635fef5f8017a

Settings Page 1

635fefbe4c8f1

Settings Page 2

635ff07ad78c9

That is rather odd... Here is an example of a DNP Binary Out from a live system. > BO Tag using DNP3 ![635fef5f8017a](serve/attachment&path=635fef5f8017a) > Settings Page 1 ![635fefbe4c8f1](serve/attachment&path=635fefbe4c8f1) > Settings Page 2 ![635ff07ad78c9](serve/attachment&path=635ff07ad78c9)
edited Oct 31 '22 at 4:33 pm

Are you able to send anything other than a 1ms close pulse because nothing i configured with that style setup was able to actually send an appropriate pulse to the RTAC?

Because all the documentation talks about needing to map negative and postive values in the button and that the "pulse duration" in the tag means nothing to the actual DNP control.

I need to hold the pulse on for 2 sec to ensure the breaker operates appropriately.

Some of my controls are one DNP point utilizing both TRIP and CLOSE commands and some have the TRIP and CLOSE split into separate points.

Are you able to send anything other than a 1ms close pulse because nothing i configured with that style setup was able to actually send an appropriate pulse to the RTAC? Because all the documentation talks about needing to map negative and postive values in the button and that the "pulse duration" in the tag means nothing to the actual DNP control. I need to hold the pulse on for 2 sec to ensure the breaker operates appropriately. Some of my controls are one DNP point utilizing both TRIP and CLOSE commands and some have the TRIP and CLOSE split into separate points.

No, the pulse duration from SCADA was trouble.
The solution:

  • Send a pulse from SCADA to the RTAC
  • Change the pulse of the mapped BO point. Need to make sure the the type of command you send has a duration available in the RTAC. 635ff96be90d8

For instance, you don't want to use the LATCH option.
635ffce8694b6

No, the pulse duration from SCADA was trouble. The solution: - Send a pulse from SCADA to the RTAC - Change the pulse of the mapped BO point. Need to make sure the the type of command you send has a duration available in the RTAC. ![635ff96be90d8](serve/attachment&path=635ff96be90d8) For instance, you don't want to use the LATCH option. ![635ffce8694b6](serve/attachment&path=635ffce8694b6)
edited Oct 31 '22 at 4:50 pm

I guess that could physically work if you only need to have one type of command per DNP point and you are willing to custom program the RTAC to translate all commands into what they are actually supposed to do.

For me i really need to use it with proper TRIP and CLOSE signals so i have it programmed as analogs as they have designed it.

I guess that could physically work if you only need to have one type of command per DNP point and you are willing to custom program the RTAC to translate all commands into what they are actually supposed to do. For me i really need to use it with proper TRIP and CLOSE signals so i have it programmed as analogs as they have designed it.

BDAVIS, sorry for any confusion.

To clarify the above:

If tag is setup as shown in the 'DNP3 Address Select' window, the 'Trip/Close' will be sent as a Binary Out command block (whatever is opposite of the current state of the tag).

When the RTAC gets that command, it will apply the pulse in the Trip and Close settings per that Binary Out tag in the RTAC (the default is 2000 ms).

So, even with a 'short' pulse (command) from VTScada, the end device is still getting a 2 second Trip or Close pulse by default.

Customization is only needed is that isn't long enough.

BDAVIS, sorry for any confusion. To clarify the above: If tag is setup as shown in the 'DNP3 Address Select' window, the 'Trip/Close' will be sent as a Binary Out command block (whatever is opposite of the current state of the tag). When the RTAC gets that command, it will apply the pulse in the Trip and Close settings per that Binary Out tag in the RTAC (the default is 2000 ms). So, even with a 'short' pulse (command) from VTScada, the end device is still getting a 2 second Trip or Close pulse by default. Customization is only needed is that isn't long enough.
edited Nov 7 '22 at 2:27 pm

The way to get this to function correctly is to use an I/O tag configured as an Analog output instead of using a Digital output. When using an digital values, these get converted to a Boolean (0 or 1) for use by the driver, this is why you are always seeing a 1ms output. Using an analog allows the wide range of values (negative and positive) needed to control the trip/close pulse widths. When configuring the analog tag, make sure that the scaling values are set to a wide enough range to give you the output values needed.

The way to get this to function correctly is to use an I/O tag configured as an Analog output instead of using a Digital output. When using an digital values, these get converted to a Boolean (0 or 1) for use by the driver, this is why you are always seeing a 1ms output. Using an analog allows the wide range of values (negative and positive) needed to control the trip/close pulse widths. When configuring the analog tag, make sure that the scaling values are set to a wide enough range to give you the output values needed.

Lawrence MacNeil
Trihedral Engineering Limited

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